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Exciting News!

I am officially banned from "Mark Watches"! I am sort of impressed. He just posted about "Smashed" today. If I am too controversial in my opinions about Season 6 Buffy/Spike, it's going to be a bloodbath over there.

In related news, you were all right.

This entry was originally posted at http://rebcake.dreamwidth.org/25465.html. Please comment here or there using OpenID.

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( 221 comments — Leave a comment )
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rahirah
Jul. 19th, 2012 03:21 am (UTC)
His tool factor does seem to be rising weekly...
menomegirl
Jul. 19th, 2012 03:53 am (UTC)
Yes, it is.
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cindergal
Jul. 19th, 2012 03:22 am (UTC)
Wait! Why? What happened? I do not read him, although of course I've heard about him. I need details! ;-)
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:08 am (UTC)
Well, it's Smashed and his review stated that "Spike beat her" and this beauty:

And I must be fair here: Spike is INCREDIBLY inappropriate here.

So. Well. You can imagine. He also was very upset when people started talking about how hot they thought the sex scene was. Apparently, that is Not Correct, since it was abusive. Then all the intimations of non-con and the rape talk started up as applied to this episode. It's gonna be ugly.

Edited at 2012-07-19 06:47 am (UTC)
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spikesjojo
Jul. 19th, 2012 03:25 am (UTC)
Hey, I was banned too! Welcome, sister! I assume you also said that Buffy was not a victim?

It won't be a bloodbath because he's gonna get rid of anyone who disagrees with him.
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:00 am (UTC)
Nope. He said that he thought Buffy was justified in hitting Spike first, because he touched her (I have some sympathy for that, actually) and then because he wouldn't leave her alone. I said that in my view actual hitting trumps provocation, though people do seem to disagree on that point.

I was in the middle of making my "Mom's argument for 'no hitting'" when I was banned. For making a "rape threat/joke". Wha? I'm pretty sure that I did no such thing. Not a joking matter, for one thing, and also I fail to see how arguing against violence is somehow a threat of same.

What I meant by bloodbath is that he will end up banning everybody with a different viewpoint. That's okay. He doesn't have to be a repository for free speech (although I do feel a bit libeled at the mo'). ;-)
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fenchurche
Jul. 19th, 2012 03:25 am (UTC)
I quit reading "Mark Watches" awhile back... and judging by the comments I'm seeing about it, I'm kinda glad I did.
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:11 am (UTC)
Yeah, the veterans tried to warn us. Shoulda listened.
2maggie2
Jul. 19th, 2012 03:30 am (UTC)
I only intermittently look in. What thought crime did you commit?
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:13 am (UTC)
I thought Buffy overreacted with the violence. Bad Rebcake! No cookie!

Edited at 2012-07-19 07:53 am (UTC)
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eilowyn
Jul. 19th, 2012 03:36 am (UTC)
Oh God. I go to check my LJ and the first two posts are people banned for Mark Watches. For mentioning Buffy might have a mental illness, my guess? Has anyone thought to link to gabrielleabelle's "Buffy Came Back Wrong" series? When I get home I'll check out the discussion, but Mark seems to be quite the egoist asshole to me.
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:14 am (UTC)
Nah. I was on the "it's mutual" train, while implying that Buffy hit Spike first. Tsk. Silly me.
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molly_may
Jul. 19th, 2012 03:41 am (UTC)
Wow, there are two posts in a row from people on my flist who were banned from there today! It's completely ridiculous - he apparently can't handle any sort of difference of opinion.

Heh. Your icon is perfect for times like this.
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:19 am (UTC)
It was a close thing between that icon and this one. *points*

Yeah, it's kind of amazing how fast things got touchy. Buffy and Spike are far more fraught than I ever imagined. I didn't think it would get there until Seeing Red but it's already happening.

It's his space, though, so power to him.
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ms_scarletibis
Jul. 19th, 2012 03:47 am (UTC)
No bloodbath, for I'm sure opposing comments will soon disappear...

ms_scarletibis
Jul. 19th, 2012 04:10 am (UTC)
Also, the "rape apologists" comments have arisen...the next few eps are sure to be great!
(no subject) - rebcake - Jul. 19th, 2012 06:25 am (UTC) - Expand
menomegirl
Jul. 19th, 2012 03:55 am (UTC)
I saw that he had banned someone else (in a very rude manner) but had no idea he'd banned you too.

I'm not sure if you deserve a hug or congratulations so I'll leave you with my Harmony icon.

sockmonkeyhere
Jul. 19th, 2012 04:23 am (UTC)
Does he use a name other than "Mark" when he posts replies to comments? Or does he post replies at all? I'm trying to follow the drama but I can't tell who's who. *g*
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coalitiongirl
Jul. 19th, 2012 04:02 am (UTC)
Meh. I'm beginning to understand what fandom was like back in the day, when even the rational arguments are immediately SHUT DOWN if you're a Spike fan. (And yours seemed fair-minded and reasonable, so I was surprised at the reception. Mark's a little touchy today, apparently. :/)
menomegirl
Jul. 19th, 2012 04:05 am (UTC)
I'm beginning to understand what fandom was like back in the day

It was horrible. The comments made today on Mark Watches are really tame in comparison, actually.
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sockmonkeyhere
Jul. 19th, 2012 04:15 am (UTC)
[Cartman voice]BAD KITTEH! THAT'S A BAD, BAD KITTEH![/Cartman voice] *chases you around the room with a rolled-up newspaper*

Some of the rules on that site really baffle me. Apparently you're not allowed to use words like "blind" and "deaf", for instance...there's nothing shameful or offensive about being blind or deaf, so why should he act as if there is by banning the correct medical terms for those conditions?

Did they tell you why you're banned? If he truly is unspoiled, does he have a moderator who screens all feedback and rot13s the spoilery comments? Does he decides who gets banned, or does the moderator do it? I'm curious about how that whole shebang works!

If I am too controversial in my opinions about Season 6 Buffy/Spike, it's going to be a bloodbath over there.

Heh, when he started his Spuffy sex commentary by describing how he once had a boyfriend who demanded that their relationship be kept a secret, I thought for sure that he'd say "So I understand how Spike must feel." But he didn't. Instead he added that his boyfriend had isolated him from everyone, and I thought "Ah, crap, he's gonna see the entire story as Buffy being the victim and Spike being the bad person, instead of seeing that BOTH characters are a little of each and are equally at fault."

In related news, you were all right.

*is nosy*
'bout what? :)
ms_scarletibis
Jul. 19th, 2012 05:52 am (UTC)
You also can't use "bitch" (as in "She was a total bad ass bitch!") or "crazy" (as in "that crazy rain").
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mad_brilliant_
Jul. 19th, 2012 05:25 am (UTC)
Huh. I can't seem to find his Wrecked entry. The most recent I can find is Tabula Rasa. Maybe he banned himself.
sockmonkeyhere
Jul. 19th, 2012 05:46 am (UTC)
Maybe he banned himself.

*spittake* XD

Reb may have meant "Smashed." That's the latest episode he's got up.
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3hours
Jul. 19th, 2012 05:30 am (UTC)
/pat

This is why I've never commented on Mark Watches, and only read the comments from 2-3 people on each post. Drama llama ding dong.
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 08:03 am (UTC)
It's all fun and games until the Spuffy gets real! Who knew? Besides everybody?
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lostboy_lj
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:04 am (UTC)
I don't see "Smashed" or "Wrecked" posted on the Mark Watches site. Maybe instead of being banned, there was a hiccup in the Matrix?
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:51 am (UTC)
Nah. I'm banned. Though, I have to say, I do not think that what I said means what he thinks it means. Like, at all.
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elisi
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:50 am (UTC)
You mean 'Smashed'. ;)

And like sockmonkeyhere I also immediately thought that his situation mirrored Spike's - except I knew he'd make it about Buffy. I'm going to wait a few episodes before I try to point this out. ;)

Also your banishment is... not unexpected. I might go over and talk about Fifty Shades of Grey and how clearly MILLIONS of people find 'abuse' hot... (Of course Spike/Buffy is at this point dysfunctional as hell, but it's also very very hot. Telling people that they're not allowed to think so is *quite* the bossiest kind of thought police I've come across in a long time.)

Ah, Spuffy. Long live the controversy. (And according to the blurb on the latest comic - the new Spike series - he and Buffy are in a 'on-and-off-again relationship. Go them! *g*)

ETA: For people who can't see the entry, go to: http://markwatches.net/reviews/

Edited at 2012-07-19 06:51 am (UTC)
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:57 am (UTC)
Yes! I do mean "Smashed".

I don't think it was the "different strokes" post that set him off. It was the arguing that Buffy might have overreacted when she hit Spike 'cos he was bugging her. Though, perhaps it was a combination of things.

And yes, his "we're on the downlow" relationship exactly mirrors Spike's situation, but I couldn't think of a way to be explicit about that without spoilers, so...

I was taken aback by all the non-con and rape talk at this juncture. Whoa. Backing away.
beer_good_foamy
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:59 am (UTC)
He started banning people already? And for that? Hoooo boy. Season 6 is going to get ugly. I stopped commenting a while back; at least Mark has the excuse of calling it as he sees it the first time, but there are some very entrenched old fandom opinions coming out all over the place...
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 08:36 am (UTC)
Yep. I'd say there's been a change in his level of investment between Tabula Rasa and Smashed. He seemed to be letting the commentors do their thing before, mostly. But now he's in there swinging for his POV at every turn. Season Six: not for the faint of heart.
treadingthedark
Jul. 19th, 2012 07:07 am (UTC)
Heh, when he started his Spuffy sex commentary by describing how he once had a boyfriend who demanded that their relationship be kept a secret, I thought for sure that he'd say "So I understand how Spike must feel." But he didn't.

Me too! I totally thought that.
That shit got CRAZY! Yes, I said CRAZY!
No more Mark for me.
I have never felt so repressed and I didn't even make a post!
eilowyn
Jul. 19th, 2012 07:35 am (UTC)
I KNOW! Season 6 Buffy/Spike is a CLOSETED RELATIONSHIP!
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(Anonymous)
Jul. 19th, 2012 07:57 am (UTC)
I've just re-read your comments twice and still have no idea why Mark reacted the way he did.
Than I read all the comments to 'Smashed' and he seems completely offensive to everyone whose opinion is differnt from his own ...
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 08:52 am (UTC)
It's weird. It's like he was waiting for this episode to go on a rampage. Apparently, he's just reflecting the fandom reality that this ep is a game changer.
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norwie2010
Jul. 19th, 2012 08:04 am (UTC)
Congrats. :-)
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 08:15 am (UTC)
Thankee! It's (almost) an honor!
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shapinglight
Jul. 19th, 2012 10:31 am (UTC)
I'm so glad I bailed on MW back in season 1. I knew he would hate Spike, and I've already read enough Spike-hate to last me a lifetime, thanks.

Kudos to you for getting banned. There should be a medal.
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 05:42 pm (UTC)
You were so, so right. And I do feel as if I've earned my spurs, whatever that means. ;-)
sueworld2003
Jul. 19th, 2012 10:45 am (UTC)
God but this man is such an arsehole. :(
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 05:56 pm (UTC)
Heh. I just can't bestir myself to argue with you. ;-)
penny_lane_42
Jul. 19th, 2012 01:43 pm (UTC)
At least he's honest about the fact that his own experience is what's totally dominating his view of all this. I hadn't read any of his reviews since, like, "Fool for Love," but I went over and read this one and it was ALL ABOUT HIM, which is fine, because it's his website. And it's even fine if he doesn't want to tolerate other people's opinions, but he should STATE THAT OUTRIGHT. I've done that before, said, "I can't be unemotional about this, and I know it, so if you disagree, please just don't say anything." The fact that he didn't say that and then starts banning people is ridiculous.

Whatever. Good riddance.
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:07 pm (UTC)
Yeah, his reviews are what they are. The discussion is a separate issue and he's been relatively hands off unless he's called out. This time he dove in to defend his POV like whoa. The discussion really seemed to throw him. I wouldn't be surprised if he does post such instructions ("if you don't like it, sit down and shut up") before too long. Maybe he'll be happier if people stop popping up with their upsetting different viewpoints.
lostboy_lj
Jul. 19th, 2012 02:06 pm (UTC)
Oh, okay I finally saw the "Smashed" post and the comments thread that got you banned.

I don't read "Mark Watches", but I could tell it wasn't my kind of place a few comments in, when someone got reported and warned for using the word "bipolar." From his commentary, it sounds like Mark and many of his fans are stuck on the middle TV tropes layer of the show, anyway (which is the least interesting one in my opinion).

I've been there, done that. Lostgirl still makes fun of me for how involved I eventually became in the Buffy fandom, considering that my first reaction to the show was total disgust/revulsion. She was watching a rerun of "Becoming, Part 1" and I walked in at the point when Angel and Buffy were duking it out in the graveyard. I didn't know much of anything about the show at that point - all I saw was a very big guy punching a very petite woman in the face and then hurling her to the ground, which at the time I thought was gross and disturbing. I didn't really "get" the show yet.
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:16 pm (UTC)
all I saw was a very big guy punching a very petite woman in the face and then hurling her to the ground, which at the time I thought was gross and disturbing

I never thought of that! It would be soooo disturbing out of context. Context is no doubt a big part of why people see things so differently. I'm really interested in the gender shifting of the show, but I'd imagine there are people who just don't make that leap and continue to see Buffy just as she appears, at her essence.
(no subject) - lostboy_lj - Jul. 19th, 2012 06:38 pm (UTC) - Expand
brutti_ma_buoni
Jul. 19th, 2012 02:56 pm (UTC)
D'aww. It's like you were alive during the shipper wars! (Or so they tell me. I'm far too young to remember.) Brava!
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:19 pm (UTC)
Way back in "ought two"...

I do feel strangely venerable. Hee!
(no subject) - boot_the_grime - Jul. 19th, 2012 10:33 pm (UTC) - Expand
wo_meimei
Jul. 19th, 2012 04:25 pm (UTC)
I'm torn between amusement and frustration over the whole "omg, Spike raped Buffy!" thing going on there.

I'd heard that argument before and I ended up analyzing the episode and characters along with modern California sex laws. It's a load of half-baked rubbish.
rebcake
Jul. 19th, 2012 06:22 pm (UTC)
It's really creepy how little agency some people are willing to give Buffy at this point. But, you know, for her own good. Grrr.
(no subject) - shipperx - Jul. 19th, 2012 06:50 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - rebcake - Jul. 19th, 2012 07:06 pm (UTC) - Expand
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